Old Ideas.

What's working? What isn't? What could be improved? Let's hear your ideas on how to improve AGR, and try to achieve .. perfection.
Jonan
Posts: 336
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:51 pm

Old Ideas.

Post by Jonan »

I was brainstorming in the past, about a TF / Custom TF concepts that could be used. In a dream project.
Here is some of them, keep in mind I haven't tried every aspect of AGR, and some of these ideas may be redundant.

(Team Resups) A standard pack will spawn on team spawns, every 60 seconds. 5 Health, 10 Red Armor, 1 G1, 1 G2, 10 Shells, 10 Nails, 5 Rockets, 5 Cells. This could be a setting.

(Action Speed) This will effect the speed of manual (melee) weapons, and reload time. This was to help faster classes be more competitive with soldiers. It would work as such, your movement speed / 240 giving you a percentage of speed that would effect manual weapons, such as axes, spanners, knives, bio-weapon (axe), shotgun, super shotgun, grenade launcher, pipe launcher, rocket launcher, etc. Scout 450/240 = 187.5%, Sniper/Pyro/Spy/Engineer 300/240 = 125%, Soldier 240/240 = 100%, Demoman 280/240 = 116.7%, Medic 320/240 = 133.3%, HWGuy 230/240 = 95.8%. Speeds were based off of OzTF. This way, lighter classes would reload and attack faster.

(Recovery) This would enable you to regenerate and heal from fire / disease / tranqs / concussions / gas etc. Each class would have a recovery time, upon standing still they would have an auto heal once they hit a certain time. First cycle would heal, then after that, say plus 1 health. It would be based upon your movement speed / full health. Scout 450/75 = 6 seconds, Sniper 300/90 = 3.3 seconds, Soldier 240/100 = 2.4 seconds, Demoman 280/90 = 3.1 seconds, Medic 320/90 = 3.6 seconds (medikit would half it), HWGuy 230/100 = 2.3 seconds, Pyro 300/100 = 3.0 seconds, Spy 300/90 = 3.3 seconds, Engineer 300/80 = 3.8 seconds.

(Wooden Armor) If on fire, increased duration.

(Caltrop Grenades) Grenade + Caltrop Canister.

(Flares) If hit with one, you will see the snipe dots everywhere, or perhaps could be worked into gas.

(Air Grenades) Concussion Grenade, without the dizziness.

(Stim Packs) Medikit Grenade, if you hold til it explodes you get healed, otherwise it medikits the area.

(Throwing Knives) Flies like a flare, but is blade 50 damage or so.

(Corruption) Whether added to a weapon (spanner? railgun?) or a greande, if hit by it, you'd lose a level of armor quality. Special Armors -> Red -> Yellow -> Green -> None.

(Multi-buy) Some items you can buy extra copies of, such as the army, and senrty. Perhaps you could buy extra medikits for bonus regeneration. Double or Triple Blast Armor, Triple Kevlar?

(Alternative GL) Perhaps you could buy GL without the Pipe Launcher. Alternative upgrades, Proximity Launcher (like Scourage of Armagon), Long Ranged GL (like from old MegaTF), Short Fuse GL (half timer), Long Fuse GL (double timer).

(Glue Gun) A gun that shoots the globe-light in a fashion similar to Mr. Incredible in Incredibles. When he gets overwhelmed with globs of slime.

(Low Player Count Barrier) Instead of a wall, perhaps a army bot spawn?

(Quad Shot) Four Barrelled Shot Gun.

(Pyro Toys) Perhaps you can buy seperately? A long ranged flame thrower?

(Flame Nail Weapons) Like in Dissolution of Eternity.

(Flame Shot) Like in Metal Slug.

(Climbing Axe) There is a mod, Ninja Quake, where you can attack the walls, and it will pull you up them, allowing you to climb up them.

(Taser) Really short ranged (melee) Lightning Gun, that can stun the enemy.

(Bubble Gun) Shoots out drowning damage, if you are in water and shoot an enemy, it starts their drowning, if team mate, resets their drowning counter.

(Block / Wall) Perhaps you could build just a solid block, with say 1000 health, just to bottle neck things.

(Supressor) I used to play a version of Custom TF, where you could build a device that stops you from attacking when you are near to it. You could still throw grenades however.

(Kennel) Buildable Kennel, that spawns the rottwielers. Likewise could be a Dog Handler Profession. Like an alternative version of army. Perhaps dogs can smell spys, when they level up.

(Push Trigger) Like the field generator, but you could make a push trigger.

(Tractor Beam) Some versions of Custom TF, have an upgrade for this. However, perhaps it could be a weapon. Standing still, you can pull enemies toward you.

(ID) When you ID players, it often says Custom Player Class. However, they have a skin of a classic class. Couldn't it say Custom Soldier (or the like)

(Skins) Sometimes you see Warlock, Crusader, etc, can't we have skins for them?o Weapon

(Spawn) Buildable Team Spawn? For either team. Place a convient spawn for your team, or an inconvient one for your enemy.

OneManClan
Site Admin
Posts: 281
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Re: Old Ideas.

Post by OneManClan »

Jonan wrote:I was brainstorming in the past, about a TF / Custom TF concepts that could be used. In a dream project.
Here is some of them, keep in mind I haven't tried every aspect of AGR, and some of these ideas may be redundant.
Ok, I was gonna wait until I could write the perfect response, but this list is too epic, si I'm gonna just have a go at it, and of course, because its a forum, I can always elaborate, clarify, or be corrected if I misunderstood anything. SO! Lets GO: :)
Jonan wrote:(Team Resups) A standard pack will spawn on team spawns, every 60 seconds. 5 Health, 10 Red Armor, 1 G1, 1 G2, 10 Shells, 10 Nails, 5 Rockets, 5 Cells. This could be a setting.
The current pack situation is still based off what the map makers put in the map. There are some maps where the supply is too low for Blue to D, so they have been fixed via ent edits. I also made a few changes to the way health is delivered (slowly!) like Half Life. Most respawns have respawning 'stuff' (its VERY map dependant), so while there may be a prob w a map here and there, I'm not aware of I'm not aware of this being a problem in general.
Jonan wrote: (Action Speed) This will effect the speed of manual (melee) weapons, and reload time. This was to help faster classes be more competitive with soldiers. It would work as such, your movement speed / 240 giving you a percentage of speed that would effect manual weapons, such as axes, spanners, knives, bio-weapon (axe), shotgun, super shotgun, grenade launcher, pipe launcher, rocket launcher, etc. Scout 450/240 = 187.5%, Sniper/Pyro/Spy/Engineer 300/240 = 125%, Soldier 240/240 = 100%, Demoman 280/240 = 116.7%, Medic 320/240 = 133.3%, HWGuy 230/240 = 95.8%. Speeds were based off of OzTF. This way, lighter classes would reload and attack faster.
This is what the new Berseker skill/Super Power does, though it affects all weapons, and grenades, and reload times, and anyone can buy it.
Jonan wrote: (Recovery) This would enable you to regenerate and heal from fire / disease / tranqs / concussions / gas etc. Each class would have a recovery time, upon standing still they would have an auto heal once they hit a certain time. First cycle would heal, then after that, say plus 1 health. It would be based upon your movement speed / full health. Scout 450/75 = 6 seconds, Sniper 300/90 = 3.3 seconds, Soldier 240/100 = 2.4 seconds, Demoman 280/90 = 3.1 seconds, Medic 320/90 = 3.6 seconds (medikit would half it), HWGuy 230/100 = 2.3 seconds, Pyro 300/100 = 3.0 seconds, Spy 300/90 = 3.3 seconds, Engineer 300/80 = 3.8 seconds.
See "auto-heal" in the 'body modification' menu. Good News: it heals EVERYTHING. Bad News: you have to keep 100% still.
Jonan wrote: (Wooden Armor) If on fire, increased duration.
'Wooden' was the name given to ceramic in ancient times , now we have 'anti-shock' armour - I cant see the 'entertainment value' in fire becoming *more* deadly.
Jonan wrote: (Caltrop Grenades) Grenade + Caltrop Canister.
We already have caltrops, so I'm not sure what you mean. A specific grenade which explodes a bunch of caltrops? Like the Mirv does w grens?

(Flares) If hit with one, you will see the snipe dots everywhere, or perhaps could be worked into gas.[/quote]
Hmm. dunno about this one.. if the purpose is to confuse sniper victims, gas (and caltrops) is already pretty effective
Jonan wrote:(Air Grenades) Concussion Grenade, without the dizziness.
For the purpose of moving/throwing players around .. hmm I've have something in the works for a while now which (kinda) does that . and its not a grenade.. hmm I'll get back to you. Also Medic (and autoheal) get minimal concussion.
Jonan wrote:(Stim Packs) Medikit Grenade, if you hold til it explodes you get healed, otherwise it medikits the area.
Interesting... I think I made the dispensor heal as well.. tbh I dont remember if it does it or not - whether it works of wa sa wip.. i have no memory of announcing it, so Ill assume its a wip.. still a grenade that gives health might be interesting... and ANY new grenade is gonna need an ADDITIONAL menu anyway.. hmm.. gonna think about this one

Jonan wrote:(Throwing Knives) Flies like a flare, but is blade 50 damage or so.
NICE! And with AGRv5 it will be possible (potentially) to actually SEE the knife sticking out!
Jonan wrote:(Corruption) Whether added to a weapon (spanner? railgun?) or a greande, if hit by it, you'd lose a level of armor quality. Special Armors -> Red -> Yellow -> Green -> None.
I think they do that anyway..
Jonan wrote:(Multi-buy) Some items you can buy extra copies of, such as the army, and senrty. Perhaps you could buy extra medikits for bonus regeneration. Double or Triple Blast Armor, Triple Kevlar?
Sounds interesting, but the potential to unbalance the gameplay is huge, and AGR gameplay has been finely tuned over a long period, so I'd hesitate doing this .. unless there was some HUGE entertainment value to compensate for unpredictable gameplay results.
Jonan wrote:(Alternative GL) Perhaps you could buy GL without the Pipe Launcher. Alternative upgrades, Proximity Launcher (like Scourage of Armagon), Long Ranged GL (like from old MegaTF), Short Fuse GL (half timer), Long Fuse GL (double timer).
.
Yea I remember the long range GL .. very entertaining, potentially game unbalancing .. maybe it can be an upgrade to the GL, or have some disadvantage..
Jonan wrote:(Glue Gun) A gun that shoots the globe-light in a fashion similar to Mr. Incredible in Incredibles. When he gets overwhelmed with globs of slime.
we already have tranquiliser.. BUT it would definitely be more entertaining to see players covered in goo.. again the code behind the AGRv5 engine makes this POSSIBLE!
Jonan wrote:(Low Player Count Barrier) Instead of a wall, perhaps a army bot spawn?
Well the purpose of the wall is so that Blue can 100% not have to think about that entrance - actually .. you just reminded me.. theres no announcement declaring walls up" or "walls down".. hmm
Jonan wrote:(Quad Shot) Four Barrelled Shot Gun.
A silly, childish idea. It would be ridiculous looking. Completely over the top. Love it!
Jonan wrote:(Pyro Toys) Perhaps you can buy seperately? A long ranged flame thrower?
Too 'gameplay balance disrupting' - unless it was limited somehow - i akways theought the napalm grens were kinda boring - maybe they can be .. i dunno.. made more.. um.. interesting..
Jonan wrote:(Flame Nail Weapons) Like in Dissolution of Eternity.
Cant picture this. I youtube'd 'Dissolution of Eternity' and didnt see it.. but I DID see the nail gun heat up when used!! GREAT idea! [OMC adds it to the list].
Jonan wrote:(Flame Shot) Like in Metal Slug.
Don't know it, can't picture it.
Jonan wrote:(Climbing Axe) There is a mod, Ninja Quake, where you can attack the walls, and it will pull you up them, allowing you to climb up them.
Um.. I started work on 'something completely different but similar' a while ago.. and its been shelved.. not enough time, and too nervous about messing up our sacred AGR gameplay.
Jonan wrote:(Taser) Really short ranged (melee) Lightning Gun, that can stun the enemy.
Well.. ppl hit by lightning SHOULD be (and LOOK!) stunned/shocked.. so.. yea, this makes sense. A '1/2 second psion'
Jonan wrote:(Bubble Gun) Shoots out drowning damage, if you are in water and shoot an enemy, it starts their drowning, if team mate, resets their drowning counter.
Um.. sounds fiddly.. maybe I'm not picturing this the way you intend..
Jonan wrote:(Block / Wall) Perhaps you could build just a solid block, with say 1000 health, just to bottle neck things.
YES. Not sure how it would work in practice effort to build vs effort to destroy, but in principle, LOVE it.
Jonan wrote:(Supressor) I used to play a version of Custom TF, where you could build a device that stops you from attacking when you are near to it. You could still throw grenades however.
Hmmm.. REd Alert!! maybe.. add this as an option to motion detectors?
Jonan wrote:(Kennel) Buildable Kennel, that spawns the rottwielers. Likewise could be a Dog Handler Profession. Like an alternative version of army. Perhaps dogs can smell spys, when they level up.
Yes or... BeeKeeper!!! Good News: bees are easy to kill! Bad News: theres HEAPS of them!
Jonan wrote:(Push Trigger) Like the field generator, but you could make a push trigger.
Hmmm.. well.. 1st impression - I cant see the advantage, extra entertainment value of this
Jonan wrote:(Tractor Beam) Some versions of Custom TF, have an upgrade for this. However, perhaps it could be a weapon. Standing still, you can pull enemies toward you.
Hm... Maybe add it as a Tesla upgrade ... or to the Grapple (?) ... need to think more about this one.
Jonan wrote:(ID) When you ID players, it often says Custom Player Class. However, they have a skin of a classic class. Couldn't it say Custom Soldier (or the like)
Better labels.. yes.. (yes I'm making notes)
Jonan wrote:(Skins) Sometimes you see Warlock, Crusader, etc, can't we have skins for them?o Weapon
I started work in this ages ago, actually made a (very crappy) chap skin .. but AGR4 had a LOT of skin issues/controversy.. so I put it aside. But yea, AGRv5 means a new skin is easy to put in.
Jonan wrote:(Spawn) Buildable Team Spawn? For either team. Place a convient spawn for your team, or an inconvient one for your enemy.
Interesting .. often the POINT of teles is to get players from respawn to action asap.. so why not just make the new thing the respawn - otoh hacked teles already do this so.. not sure this would make much improvement gameplay.


Wow - so I got to the end!!! Sorry for the delay!

A LOT of stuff to think about (thanks) meanwhile, FYI, here's a list of things I've now added to my TO DO list:
  • walls up down announcement
    4 barrel shotgun (more?)
    tranquiilizer goo
    long distance GL option
    visually see asscan / heat up
    hit by lightning shock
    build a wall
    motion detectior hack to supress firing
    Bee keeper
    Skins for chap, crusader etc
Dunno when/if I'll have the chance to try to them, I've got a backlog of 'almost finished'; stuff i need to complete (the BIG one is a new player model+animations!!), but thanks Jonan, you've definitely given me much to think about!

Jonan
Posts: 336
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:51 pm

Re: Old Ideas.

Post by Jonan »

OneManClan wrote:
"Team Resups" : The current pack situation is still based off what the map makers put in the map. There are some maps where the supply is too low for Blue to D, so they have been fixed via ent edits. I also made a few changes to the way health is delivered (slowly!) like Half Life. Most respawns have respawning 'stuff' (its VERY map dependant), so while there may be a prob w a map here and there, I'm not aware of I'm not aware of this being a problem in general.
If you did implement "Team Resups" it could be a quick way for testing new maps live on servers. If players are complaining not enough resups, you can turn on "Team Resups" on, and restart map. Could be a handy quick / blanket fix.

Jonan
Posts: 336
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:51 pm

Re: Old Ideas.

Post by Jonan »

OneManClan wrote:
"Caltrop Grenades" : We already have caltrops, so I'm not sure what you mean. A specific grenade which explodes a bunch of caltrops? Like the Mirv does w grens?
Yes, just like a Mirv, but with caltrops instead of mini-grens.

Since you've moved Flares from the grenade menu, does Caltrop Canister need to be still there too? It doesn't prime like grenades, seems a little out of place.

Jonan
Posts: 336
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:51 pm

Re: Old Ideas.

Post by Jonan »

OneManClan wrote: "Stim Packs"
Interesting... I think I made the dispensor heal as well.. tbh I dont remember if it does it or not - whether it works of wa sa wip.. i have no memory of announcing it, so Ill assume its a wip.. still a grenade that gives health might be interesting... and ANY new grenade is gonna need an ADDITIONAL menu anyway.. hmm.. gonna think about this one
Could always add a dispenser upgrade. So you can get health, medikit, grenades, biosuit, detpacks, faster production, etc.

I think in some versions of MegaTF, the Medic could upgrade the dispenser to have health packs. Perhaps we could have something similar. Someone with Medikit could add health. Someone with Mirvs or Detpacks could add grenades. Someone with Biosuit could add short term biosuits (10 seconds).

Jonan
Posts: 336
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:51 pm

Re: Old Ideas.

Post by Jonan »

OneManClan wrote:
"Corruption" I think they do that anyway..
First off, Red Quality Armour = 80% Damage Absorption, Yellow Quality Armour = 60% Damage Absorption, Green Quality Armour = 30% Damage Absorption (Quake Armours), and then you can place Wooden, Blast, Kevlar, etc (TF Bonus Armours) on top for half damage from specific weapons.

If you were up against a 300 Red Blast Armour opponent, you could hit him with the Corruption. On the first hit, it would remove any TF bonus armours, Blast in this case. Now if you are shooting with RL, you've just doubled your effectiveness vs him.

If he then received another dose of Corruption, his armour quality would drop down to the next lower level. Yellow in this case.

If he then received another does of Corruption, his armour quality would drop down to the next lower level. Green in this case.

If he then received it again, that Green armour would be removed.

If that said Opponent was to end up with 300 yellow or green armour, it would be pretty dire.

The said Opponent would go from 300 Red Blast Armour, 300 Red Armour, 300 Yellow Armour, 300 Green Armour, 300 Unarmoured Armour.
Going from being able to take 800 explosive damage, to 400 damage, to 250 damage, to 142 damage.

This is excluded any damage that would / could be taken from Corruption Grenade or Corruption Weapon.

Upon death, you'd go back to your normal armour.

This can already be done with pickup items, shouldn't be hard to implement.

Now, if you already have this, I've yet to see it.

Jonan
Posts: 336
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:51 pm

Re: Old Ideas.

Post by Jonan »

OneManClan wrote:
"Flame Shot" : Don't know it, can't picture it.
It's a shot gun with a flame burst as you fire it. I just love it form Metal Slug.

Jonan
Posts: 336
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:51 pm

Re: Old Ideas.

Post by Jonan »

OneManClan wrote: "Climbing Axe" : Um.. I started work on 'something completely different but similar' a while ago.. and its been shelved.. not enough time, and too nervous about messing up our sacred AGR gameplay.
http://www.quaketerminus.com/mods/ninjaq11.zip

Ninja stars too! :D

Jonan
Posts: 336
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:51 pm

Re: Old Ideas.

Post by Jonan »

OneManClan wrote:
"Push Trigger" : Hmmm.. well.. 1st impression - I cant see the advantage, extra entertainment value of this
Perhaps a reskinned teleporter, could bounce players up, so the whole team don't have to RJ up. Or a ladder!

Jonan
Posts: 336
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:51 pm

Re: Old Ideas.

Post by Jonan »

OneManClan wrote:
"Skins" : I started work in this ages ago, actually made a (very crappy) chap skin .. but AGR4 had a LOT of skin issues/controversy.. so I put it aside. But yea, AGRv5 means a new skin is easy to put in.
At the very least can you make it so it tries to look for tf_chap*.pcx, tf_crusade*.pcx etc, even if they are just copies of the likes of tf_sold*.pcx Then I can make my own! :D
Or I can make them for you, perhaps. Give me a list of the extra classes.

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